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Kcirtap
Officer



Joined: Aug 23, 2006
Posts: 463
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And thusly I'm brought into this :)
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Envictus
Level 40



Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 1036
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And BTW its not a "Strategy", Your giving shook too much credit. Its a kid pissed off that his big plans for the "future of vox" were a failure.

Kcirtap wrote:
And thusly I'm brought into this :)

Well the ego resemblance between you two is kinda hard to miss.
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Vumael
Level 3



Joined: Jan 19, 2008
Posts: 59

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Envictus wrote:
And BTW its not a "Strategy", Your giving shook too much credit. Its a kid pissed off that his big plans for the "future of vox" were a failure.

Kcirtap wrote:
And thusly I'm brought into this :)

Well the ego resemblance between you two is kinda hard to miss.


Guess things of the order such as rrawyx and shook collaberating to deliberately sabotage our raids and your tanking ability to try to cause a split in the guild wasnt a strategy either... or them using your blowing up in vent as a recruitment strategy.... don't underestimate them just because they're obnoxious Vik, that's exactly what they try to do. I told you back then to ignore it and I'm trying to tell you the same thing now. It isn't worth the attention you or anyone else pay it, and you're the own best recruitment poster. You satisfy their need for attention.
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Envictus
Level 40



Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 1036
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well first of all lets roll back to the original thing that pissed me off...

Vumael wrote:
There is no "truth" to be gained from mindless insult throwing and ridiculous, unstructured out of context quotations


someone CLAIMED I said something I did not say so I posted the worst part of the conversation 6 hours before... and the whole conversation (minus something that would hurt them personally) during her dropping tag.

I don't understand how much closer you get to the "truth" of what I said than posting what I said.

If theres no truth to be gained from what you call flaming I can safely say theres no truth to be gained from simply silencing people. The only "truth" gained from any form of censorship is the truth created by those doing the censoring.

As for the "plot".

You did say to ignore them at the time and others did as well... but thats the fucking problem, I've seen in this guild over and over and over for 2 fucking years ignoring things that should not be ignored. They fester and turn into bad shit.

The main reason I was pissed AFTER that went down (because keep in mind they recruited NO ONE except the original people involved) was the LACK of support from people who were in the know.... the one person who "sort of" finally called rrawx on the fact he was pretending to know nothing was Fio after I pushed her into it.

First one to step up should have been the officers (kcirtap/dyscordia). Kcirtap also admitted to me on a separate occasion that he knew about another previous deal like this and didn't tell me because he wanted people to be able to come to him with stuff.... yea thats great.... and the kind of support a leader needs. This was before i repromoted him. Yet again I find out that those 2 knew somthing more about the plot than I did prior to that saturday night. I dont know exactly how much becasue to be quite honest I tend to find a lack of true openness with quite a few people. That in itself bothers me greatly.

A lot of people involved also told me after they didn't expect the vanero shit that night. (possibly a lie). But the reality is I'm not mad at vanero because I already knew he was a piece of shit. I'm mad at the people INSIDE my guild for what I consider lack of support. Over and over again I find out about things people try to hide. Thats the FUEL for people pulling shit like what crimson tried. (that and vydar helping to get 2 utterly lonely people get together).

Yea, there was a plot but, the entire attempt to make me look like I was fucking up the tanking failed.... and guess what? The ones to blame weren't ONLY the ones who left. The people to blame are the ones who knew and kept it secret. In some way that mentality will bite the guild again. I've seen it happen over and over and over. There are too many people here trying to "keep their options open" or are out for themselves. When all they REALLY have to do to succeed is focus and stick together.

Vumael wrote:
you're the own best recruitment poster.

See its comments like that that make me irritated at you. Its unfair and insulting. You ASSUME you know best and then make statements based on that assumption. How many people did they recruit after the original people who were going to leave anyway?

How long did crimson last? I think they lasted as about as long as most of us expected them to and ended with people stealing plat which I think most of us also expected.

People keep blaming me for shit yet the guild I was GM for for 2 years seemed to be doing pretty well and as far as I'm concerned is still doing yell. Yet I still get earfuls from people before and even up until now about people making what I consider ungrateful statements about me.

Go look at my raid record for this guild (if someone hasn't deleted it) then please procede to lick my nuts if you want to talk shit about me in regards to karma/reckoning's existance.

http://www.guild-reckoning.com/eqdkp/viewmember.php?s=&name=Envictus
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Blindside
Level 1



Joined: Dec 24, 2007
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 4:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cant we all just get along cheers
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Envictus
Level 40



Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 1036
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blindside wrote:
cant we all just get along

As a whole; On a server with a low population, high ego and plat worth real money... maybe?

With me; When people lie, push me and say what I consider stupid shit... no.

Funny thing is the only reason I was here in the first place is becasue every website on this server is being moved to a new one within the next few days... and the first thread I see contains someone claiming I said somthing I didn't.

Then it turns into people in the guild starting the very drama with me they claim they don't want becasue they can't handle the fact I don't support completely shutting down a few ex-memebers right to put thier foot in thier mouth.

http://www.mindcontroll.com/vid/wakeup.mp3
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Kcirtap
Officer



Joined: Aug 23, 2006
Posts: 463
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Insult me all you want Vik, I'm not sure why you still care to do so.
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Envictus
Level 40



Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 1036
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do so becasue I feel you deserve it based on my interaction with you. Nothing more or less.

I care becasue I spent 2 years here and with the loss of huror I don't have faith in the direction the current leadership.

I made stements about interactions I've had with you and why they piss me off. (I have plenty more as well)

Call them insults if you want, but is anything i said made up?
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Dohko
Level 7



Joined: Mar 02, 2007
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there a point to all this arguing and bickering? Why talk about guild related issues in the public forums for everyone to see?
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Dohko
Level 7



Joined: Mar 02, 2007
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

(since we can't edit) why flame the actual leadership Vik? Didn't you leave ur role as leader by choice?
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Dohko
Level 7



Joined: Mar 02, 2007
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Son of a bitch with the fucking edits, I need to stop hitting submit on this shit..

The guild cant be doing that bad if they made it to VP right?
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Envictus
Level 40



Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 1036
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I could ask you whats the point of playing video games at all?

The point (for me) is that I don't want people to assume I am content about why or how I left.

I like how expressing displeasure with someone for acting a certain way is flaming (then I guess I flamed the guild every raid and they flamed me back).

I certainly was not happy leaving the guild in the state I did, but I couldn't hurt the other people in the guild by completely pushing everyone out or saying any of this at the time. One major thing is that I did not expect huror to quit because he was one of the few remaining people I had complete trust In on a moral level. I also was not going to be playing Conan with any regularity so the option to take all the people who kept talking to me about it wasn't really a good one. I guess I left quietly to try and minimize the damage to the shrinking number of people I felt did not deserved to be damaged by my choices.

I felt extremely disappointed in the sense that clearly no one here could replace gromanns ability to work selflessly within the bounds of what I considered a moral way to operate the guild as well as accept me considering how much I play and my growing attitude towards the lack of performance and extremely disappointing attendance swings.

They couldn't achieve those things with me in my opinion, and that could be entirely my fault, but its also entirely within my rights to make my opinion known on the forum I designed and hosted for a guild I tanked, maintained DKP, and held a leadership position in for 2 years.

I was also disappointed with the fact that the information I was leaving was leaked early. Trust and loyalty is more important than ANYTHING imo when it comes to something like this. Wrong or right... I really did not feel it from the people I needed to. I left a buffer before saying any of this and I might not have said it at all if it wasn't for my need to be here for the server migration.

I don't think the guild is doing bad at all. Like I said on eq2flames Its not where you go its how you get there. If I felt differently I certainly would not have stayed on vox.

Anyone with any real analytical skills might have wondered WHY my goodbye thread was so tiny and didn't really say anything, well this is why. I expect that for the most part the guild is safe... my goal in this is not to damage the guild (anymore than I have to because I know me expressing my feelings is probably going to damage it in some way). I'm simply taking this shit off my chest. carrying the load of the bad cop was acceptable while I was playing It just sucks that It seems to still be attached a month after I quit.

Theres no edits because with the drama bullshit people can go back and claim they haven't said something or del entire posts they don't want seen in the future.
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Envictus
Level 40



Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 1036
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know wha the best part is... had people left what i said alone I can almost guarentee fio and shook would not have taken me on and the thread probably would have died...

but you want to play the on judging game (so many here are good at) in regards to what I will and wont lock here...

we can also play the judging game as to why I gave up raiding here...
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shooK
Level 7



Joined: Oct 20, 2006
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who saiz I'm lonely?
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Prizmatic
Level 5



Joined: Sep 08, 2007
Posts: 87
Location: Anchorage, Alaska

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

See the truth comes out in the long run:)
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